epa007
My 22 kw Generac model 0065530,serial 9473646 ,running LOG ,crank but does not start.I place a small gasoline shot thru air cleanener and starts,running for less than a minute,overspeed and error code 1205 from display.Anyting to play with?Thanks
Quote
Peddler
I am traveling and don't know off hand what the 1205 code is but it sounds like it is not getting any fuel. Check the fuel solenoid and the fuel pressure. If you have too much pressure they won't start or not enough. Make sure the solenoid is opening the fuel valve and you are getting pressure to the demand regulator.
Quote
GMc
E Code 1205;

Instantaneous
Over 75 Hz for 1 sec
Quote
UPS
Also noted for 1205 "Possible cause: Stepper motor/mixer body assembly issue."
Quote
MacL
make sure the stepper is properly plugged into the bottom front edge of the controller. When you press manual, the stepper should cycle and come to rest with 1/3 of the slot on the left of the pin, and 2/3 of the slot to the right.
State your problem, not your diagnosis.
Quote
epa007
Peddler;53027 wrote:
I am traveling and don't know off hand what the 1205 code is but it sounds like it is not getting any fuel. Check the fuel solenoid and the fuel pressure. If you have too much pressure they won't start or not enough. Make sure the solenoid is opening the fuel valve and you are getting pressure to the demand regulator.


Solenoid coil is not open and you can listen the solenod operation when you place battery voltage to coil.Also voltage oresent while cranking,Pending to measure fuel pressure.
Quote
epa007
MacL;53030 wrote:
make sure the stepper is properly plugged into the bottom front edge of the controller. When you press manual, the stepper should cycle and come to rest with 1/3 of the slot on the left of the pin, and 2/3 of the slot to the right.

Stepper cycle and come to rest when you you press manual.
Quote
MacL
epa007;53051 wrote:
Stepper cycle and come to rest when you you press manual.



I was more interested in where it stopped just before it began to crank. Sometimes a bad stepper will index to a nearly closed throttle position or even to a WOT position, and both of these positions would cause a crank but no start.

Did you have a plumber recently re-work the gas line to the generator? I know of a couple of instances where someone installed an "excess gas flow preventer" in the line behind the generator, and the normal gas demand would trip the device. If this were the case, the generator would start for about a second and a half, start to die, go to wide open throttle, die, then set an rpm sense loss.
State your problem, not your diagnosis.
Quote
epa007
MacL;53030 wrote:
make sure the stepper is properly plugged into the bottom front edge of the controller. When you press manual, the stepper should cycle and come to rest with 1/3 of the slot on the left of the pin, and 2/3 of the slot to the right.


epa007;53051 wrote:
Stepper cycle and come to rest when you you press manual.


MacL;53053 wrote:
I was more interested in where it stopped just before it began to crank. Sometimes a bad stepper will index to a nearly closed throttle position or even to a WOT position, and both of these positions would cause a crank but no start.

Did you have a plumber recently re-work the gas line to the generator? I know of a couple of instances where someone installed an "excess gas flow preventer" in the line behind the generator, and the normal gas demand would trip the device. If this were the case, the generator would start for about a second and a half, start to die, go to wide open throttle, die, then set an rpm sense loss.


No work with gas pipe.

Stepper motor comes to rest all the way to the left. I want to take out the stepper. Is there is a way to test the stepper? Also double check the plug to the controller, it's firm. The controller is brand new.
Quote
epa007
Peddler;53027 wrote:
I am traveling and don't know off hand what the 1205 code is but it sounds like it is not getting any fuel. Check the fuel solenoid and the fuel pressure. If you have too much pressure they won't start or not enough. Make sure the solenoid is opening the fuel valve and you are getting pressure to the demand regulator.

Pressure after solenoid is 18" and demand regilator(lower plug) is 11" while cranking.
Stepper motor come to rest all the way to the Left.I want to take our the stepper.Is there is a way to test the steeper,also double check the plug to the controller,its firm.The controller is brand new.
I think that the steeper is not good.
Quote
BrentB
Is this running on NG or LP? fuel pressure too high either way
Quote
epa007
BrentB;53058 wrote:
Is this running on NG or LP? fuel pressure too high either way


Umm,its running on LP.Well reducing the LP tank pressure will reduce the LP press either way.
What about the steeper operation?
Quote
MacL
The main test of the stepper is to pull the plug from the controller and measure the resistance from the red wire (common) to each of the other four wires. All four readings should be about 12 ohms.

Static gas pressure should be 10-12" wc, not 18. Sometimes the propane regulators on the tank or behind the generator can do funny things, like go to 18" static but go back to 11" when some is gas is bled off. Which sounds exactly like what yours is doing, a drop from 18 to 11" while cranking is far too much, so that supports the case that "sometimes" your reg allows the static pressure to get excessive (fails to seal at the valve seat perfectly), but will run well enough in motion. If it was actually set at 18" it would only drop to about 17.5" which cranking.

So regulator replacement is the solution there, I'd be willing to spend about $150? Don't go cheap. That may or may not solve the present problem, I'm leaning towards not. You can probably deal with that later.

You can take a 4mm allen or blunt end of a similar size drill bit and after pulling battery out, leave connected, and insert the tool into one of the holes in the center of the diaphragm cover and pressing gently while cranking and see if it then kicks off.

With the engine off, check the following:

Are you getting any fuel pressure when the solenoid valve is de-energized? That should be zero.
When you energize the solenoid with a jumper, does gas flow (you would hear it), or does the solenoid just open but no gas flows?
State your problem, not your diagnosis.
Quote
epa007
MacL;53060 wrote:
The main test of the stepper is to pull the plug from the controller and measure the resistance from the red wire (common) to each of the other four wires. All four readings should be about 12 ohms.



Static gas pressure should be 10-12" wc, not 18. Sometimes the propane regulators on the tank or behind the generator can do funny things, like go to 18" static but go back to 11" when some is gas is bled off. Which sounds exactly like what yours is doing, a drop from 18 to 11" while cranking is far too much, so that supports the case that "sometimes" your reg allows the static pressure to get excessive (fails to seal at the valve seat perfectly), but will run well enough in motion. If it was actually set at 18" it would only drop to about 17.5" which cranking.

So regulator replacement is the solution there, I'd be willing to spend about $150? Don't go cheap. That may or may not solve the present problem, I'm leaning towards not. You can probably deal with that later.

You can take a 4mm allen or blunt end of a similar size drill bit and after pulling battery out, leave connected, and insert the tool into one of the holes in the center of the diaphragm cover and pressing gently while cranking and see if it then kicks off.

With the engine off, check the following:

Are you getting any fuel pressure when the solenoid valve is de-energized? That should be zero.
When you energize the solenoid with a jumper, does gas flow (you would hear it), or does the solenoid just open but no gas flows?


I have been ver busy.I pull the plug from the controller and measure the resistance from the red wire (common) to each of the other four wires. All four readings are Red to Orange,Red to Yellow OPEN and Red to Brown,Red to Black 10.7-12 Ohms.If I take that motor out,Is there is any particular position or timming?
Place a new Lp regulator,engine crank and start by itself but stepper go ALL the way to the Left and does not control the speed.I move the stepper back with my finger and lower the speed.The stepper push hard toward the left...
Quote
epa007
epa007;53054 wrote:
No work with gas pipe.

Stepper motor comes to rest all the way to the left. I want to take out the stepper. Is there is a way to test the stepper? Also double check the plug to the controller, it's firm. The controller is brand new.


I have been ver busy.I pull the plug from the controller and measure the resistance from the red wire (common) to each of the other four wires. All four readings are Red to Orange,Red to Yellow OPEN and Red to Brown,Red to Black 10.7-12 Ohms.If I take that motor out,Is there is any particular position or timming?
Place a new Lp regulator,engine crank and start by itself but stepper go ALL the way to the Left and does not control the speed.I move the stepper back with my finger and lower the speed.The stepper push hard.
Quote
MacL
epa007;53107 wrote:
I have been ver busy.I pull the plug from the controller and measure the resistance from the red wire (common) to each of the other four wires. All four readings are Red to Orange,Red to Yellow OPEN and Red to Brown,Red to Black 10.7-12 Ohms.If I take that motor out,Is there is any particular position or timming?
Place a new Lp regulator,engine crank and start by itself but stepper go ALL the way to the Left and does not control the speed.I move the stepper back with my finger and lower the speed.The stepper push hard.


Ok, with two of the four coils being open, you need a new "mixer assembly", the part number should be on a foil sticker on the part.... they do not sell that stepper motor by itself.

Part number is 0K4649 for a 22kw, but this should be under warranty?

The part is under warranty, but at this point in time on your unit, not the labor and travel.
So replacement would cost about $150 if a dealer does it.


[URL="https://www.zillerelectric.com/products/generac-0k4649-mixer-assembly-22kw-evolution"]The part from Ziller[/URL] shipped to your address cost $189.79


1. Have dealer replace it: About $150-$175 (depending on their labor/travel rates)
2. IF you can get a dealer to hand you a mixer and file a claim, and you take it home and DIY, $0
3. Buy the part from Ziller and DIY, $189.79

Maybe one of the Ziller guys can advise on the best route to take.



You could probably replace it in 45 minutes, it's not extremely difficult.
State your problem, not your diagnosis.
Quote
epa007
MacL;53110 wrote:
Ok, with two of the four coils being open, you need a new "mixer assembly", the part number should be on a foil sticker on the part.... they do not sell that stepper motor by itself.

Part number is 0K4649 for a 22kw, but this should be under warranty?

The part is under warranty, but at this point in time on your unit, not the labor and travel.
So replacement would cost about $150 if a dealer does it.


[URL="https://www.zillerelectric.com/products/generac-0k4649-mixer-assembly-22kw-evolution"]The part from Ziller[/URL] shipped to your address cost $189.79


1. Have dealer replace it: About $150-$175 (depending on their labor/travel rates)
2. IF you can get a dealer to hand you a mixer and file a claim, and you take it home and DIY, $0
3. Buy the part from Ziller and DIY, $189.79

Maybe one of the Ziller guys can advise on the best route to take.



You could probably replace it in 45 minutes, it's not extremely difficult.


Part number is correct
Thaks a lot
Quote
Peddler
I would say there is a possibility that the problem is that the controller is not getting the correct speed signal from the coils which causes the stepper to go wide open. If one of the kill wires is off one of the coils or one coil is bad the controller thinks the unit is running at 1800 RPM and opens the throttle.
Quote
epa007
MacL,
Will call Ziller to find out the shipping cost for this part ,to Puerto Rico.Thanks
Quote
epa007
epa007;53129 wrote:
MacL,
Will call Ziller to find out the shipping cost for this part ,to Puerto Rico.Thanks


MacL,
Good night,thanks
Quote
epa007
Ziller does not ship to Puerto Rico. I placed the order with a different supplier, part its underway to Puerto Rico.
Quote
MacL
epa007;n58458 wrote:
Ziller does not ship to Puerto Rico. I placed the order with a different supplier, part its underway to Puerto Rico.


Alright,

Here's disassembly:

1. Remove the air box cover and filter.
2. Remove three 1/4" screws holding the plastic air duct to the partition (1/4" drive ratchet with very short or no extension)
3. Pry the round plastic plug out of the hole in the partition just below the air duct.
4. Working through holes in the partition, use an allen wrench to remove the two screws holding the mixer to the intake manifold, turn the lower screw with the ell shaped allen wrench but with a pair of pliers to turn the short end.
5. Remove the the two allen screws holding the lower airbox to the cylinder wrappers. Note the rubber washers.
6. Unplug the stepper, and feed the wire out of the wiring compartment.
7. Stand at the left end of the generator, grab the airbox with both hands, twist it left and right, rock it, as you pull toward you.
8. Use pliers to move hose clamps back, a shot of WD 40 down the end of each hose, between the metal and the rubber helps break them free.
9. Pull and twist the hoses off the mixer, re-position the hose clamps on the hoses.
10. Transfer the lower airbox to the new mixer.

On re-assembly, I get some oil off the dipstick and lubricate inside of the new mixer where it meets the orings, and smear some engine oil on the fuel pipes. As a final step, push the hoses, clamps already in position onto the fuel pipes. Do not stress the fuel pipes, they are only lightly pressed into the mixer.
State your problem, not your diagnosis.
Quote
epa007
MacL,
Mixer not arrived. But your instructions would help a lot.Thank you
Quote
epa007
Hi,
Mixer arrived and I did the replacement work.Now the generator is running well.Thaks you all.
Quote