Bowser
Installed Generac Guardian, model 0055040, ser 5405735 in Jan 2010, by
local elect. contractor. Done well until Jan 2011 when a 3-county power
outage occurred. Gen. came on but no power for house. Gen. did not shut off
so manually shut it off. Called Elect. Contr. next morning. He indicated it could
be a "fluke" but sent electrician to found breaker thrown in Gen. Retested
gen. and everything seemed okay. Gen. has only about 14 hours counting
12 min. test each Saturday. The yellow light came on after he reset Gen. I
got it off later. Still concerned however that Gen. could fail again and the
electrician never bothered to even open transfer switch or look for loose
connections, etc. Contr. said he would call company about it about 1 month
ago. Last I ever heard. The night it failed, the "snap" was much louder than
it ever had been. Does anyone have idea what caused this?
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Skip Douglas SkipD
Did you EVER witness a test (or a run during a power outage) of the generator to see that it properly provided power for the house?

I get the impression (just that - an impression) that something may have been shorted when the generator kicked in and the transfer switch transferred to the generator.
Skip Douglas
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hoghead
Bowser;8704 wrote:
Installed Generac Guardian, model 0055040, ser 5405735 in Jan 2010, by
local elect. contractor. Done well until Jan 2011 when a 3-county power
outage occurred. Gen. came on but no power for house. Gen. did not shut off
so manually shut it off. Called Elect. Contr. next morning. He indicated it could
be a "fluke" but sent electrician to found breaker thrown in Gen. Retested
gen. and everything seemed okay. Gen. has only about 14 hours counting
12 min. test each Saturday. The yellow light came on after he reset Gen. I
got it off later. Still concerned however that Gen. could fail again and the
electrician never bothered to even open transfer switch or look for loose
connections, etc. Contr. said he would call company about it about 1 month
ago. Last I ever heard. The night it failed, the "snap" was much louder than
it ever had been. Does anyone have idea what caused this?

Is this the first outage since unit was installed? This could be a installation problem with the control wiring.
Is your electrician a Generac dealer,If not you might want to call a dealer and have them look at it.Unit is still under warranty
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ohmslaw
The electrician may have left the breaker off the day of installation. If this is the first outage that would be my guess.
Tim
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Bowser
Gen. worked good for one year. We had one power outage this past summer
and it worked like a champ. It transfers well when I kick off utility power in
a test. Elect. is not a generac dealer but he stated the main electrician who
setup the gen. had been to school for Generac. I live in Iowa and we have
6 dealers for Generac I found out. Think I will contact one come Monday. Guess I will feel a little uneasy until it is checked out and have someone with a
little more experience in this area look at it. I thank all of you for answering
my post. Have a great day and work safe.
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Bowser
Generac model 0055040

Posted earlier this year. Gen did not return power to house when started.
Installer said it might be a fluke, He sent electrician who found breakers in
gen thrown. He checked nothing else. Later contacted Generac dealer.
He sent two electricians. They checked wiring in gen and transfer switch.
Said it looked like everything okay. This was in April. Gen runs every
Saturday test great. In Sept. decided to test gen. Started like a champ
but still no power to house. Called another Generac dealer and am waiting
on him now. In the meantime, I have manually tested twice. The gen.
kicked power to the house both times. What do you think is wrong with
this? Any help is appreciated.
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Enginerd
Here are three theories. 1) bad breaker 2) too much surge load on the system when you start up 3) wiring problem in conduit or other issue causing intermittent short under certain conditions, for example during rain or damp weather. Disclaimer: I am a non-electrician.
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mastr
Your post isn't worded clearly, or at least not to me. I'll try to help if you will explain a few things per my notes below.
Bowser;11535 wrote:
...Gen did not return power to house when started...

[COLOR="Red"]What does "return power" mean? Are you saying the generator doesn't power your house or that the transfer switch doesn't go back to the normal (utility) source?[/COLOR]

Quote:
...In Sept. decided to test gen. Started like a champ
but still no power to house....
[COLOR="red"]Exactly how did you "test gen"?[/COLOR]

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...In the meantime, I have manually tested twice...
[COLOR="red"]Is this the same as "test gen"?[/COLOR]

Quote:
The gen. kicked power to the house both times...
[COLOR="red"]please explain "kicked power"-do you mean it provided power or that it does not? Or maybe you mean the generator breaker trips?[/COLOR]

thank you.
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Charlie
17kW Generac 5504, breaker problem

Purchased Gen Dec 2009; installed Jan 2010 by electrical contractor. Gen.
operated well until Feb 2011 when we had 3-county power outage. Gen.
started but no power transferred to house. Had to manually shut Gen.down.
Contacted Elect. Contr. who installed. He stated probably just a "fluke".
He sent electrician who did not check anything, but opened Gen. Top and
found breakers had been thrown. He reset breakers and left. Let it go awhile and then decided to contact Generac Dealer (done no research before
I purchased Gen. thru Northern tool). Dealer said he would send someone.
Acouple weeks later two electricians showed up saying they had been sent by
dealer. They didn't bring new brks, even though dealer was aware of what
problem was. They told me wiring to Gen and switch, etc. looked good. Gen. cycles every Saturday like clock work. I did not test Gen. thru summer
until Sep. I ran test, but no power to the house (again). Opened Gen. lid
and found Brkrs had been thrown. I called new Generac Dlr and am now
awaiting his arrival. I have tested Gen. twice now and each time the Gen.
has put power to the house. I am not an electrician. What can the
problem be? Thanks much for any assistance.
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Dave_eng
Do you know how to simulate a power failure in your main supply? i.e. turn off a certain breaker. This should cause your generator to start and transfer power to your home. I would first shut off all breakers for circuits supplied by the generator and then simulate the power failure. If the generator breakers do not trip then I would start turning on a few breakers and do the power simulation test again. Keep adding breakers and doing the test until the tripping of the generator breakers occurs. Do not add breakers to the ones being tested while the generator is running as you are trying to replicate the failure mode. The starting current load of some appliance may be too much for the generator.

You may have a situation where too much load is being placed on the generator. Too many circuits are receiving power from the generator and it cannot support this load and the breakers trip.

Do this simple test and report back.

Dave p
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murphy
If the load placed on the generator, when it switches to supply power to the house, exceeds the rating on the breaker the breaker is going to trip. This is most likely if you have a lot of motor loads that try to start at the same time.
For example: refrigerator, freezer, well pump, air conditioning compressor, heat pump, oil furnace.

Motors draw 5 to 10 times their running current while starting. I would expect a 17 KW unit to be able to handle that but without knowing what inductive loads are waiting to be started in your house I'm just guessing.

Do you know if the breaker was in the off state or the tripped state?
Most breakers end up in the middle position when they trip and have to be moved to the off position to reset them.
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ceb58
You state the gen has been installed for over a year. Did the same thing happen before or was this the first time you had an outage? What dose the gen. run in an outage situation? The thing that I question is when the gen. started and transferred did you have power for a short period of time or was there truly no power. Loads like A/C units, refg. and freezers can pull a gen. down but they will not immediately try to start on having power restored they have time delays built into them so if you have power for a short period of time and the breaker trips then you need to look for the equipment that is over loading it, which would be a very large load, considering the inrush a 100amp breaker can withstand.
I will say that just looking at the wireing and breaker will not tell you any thing. The only way to know is for the elect. to megger the wireing and generator.
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Charlie
Thanks for all the help. Dave, I thought of one thing after posting my
problem. In early summer (after dealer electricians were here) I went down
into my basement and found power was lost on the east end. I had a
dehumidifier which cycled constantly. I went to the transfer switch and
found the breaker for that area of the house was at the "Middle" position.
I turned it off, then back on. Never connected that to the generator (if
their is any)i.e., I never checked the generator. I threw the dehumidifier
away. It was later in the summer when I found the breaker on Gen. and
cannot recall if it was mid-way for sure. When we installed Gen, we left
washer/dryer, kitchen range (electric), dishwasher all on main house panel.
Gen. just ran its Saturday test. I am going to run test you recommended.
Thanks to all.
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Skip Douglas SkipD
For those wondering, "Bowser" and "Charlie" are the same person. The "Bowser" account is being disabled.
Skip Douglas
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Charlie
17kw breaker problem

Dave, I did not run the test. I called Generac Dlr in nearby capital city
and he sent 2 people 5 days ago. The changed oil, new filter, new plugs,
i.e., new maintenance kit. Also, I had them put in a battery warmer. After
reading these posts, am not sure I done right thing. Anyway, engine ran
fine before they came. It ran its Saturday test today. I listened on back
deck when it came on, and something did not sound right. I listened and
engine seemed to surge and then power down a little and then pick back up.
They put on bill that they checked battery. I checked battery
today and dust all over the top. Caps had never been removed. I found
each cell had about 1 inch of water. Battery is Sears die-hard. They did
install battery warmer. Odly enough, I got the bill today for $623.00. I did
not watch them do this work but something had to take place to suddenly
cause the engine to start acting that way. I did see guy gapping plugs.
I am going to order a manual from Ziller. Thanks to all. I learn alot from
this website. Maybe Ziller should charge a small fee for keeping it.
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d11gnccer
$623.00? Maybe we should raise our service rates. Did they by any chance enable the low speed excercise? This can cause it to run pretty rough.
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Charlie
charlie

I don't know what the low speed exerciser is. They put in a new air filter so
maybe they accidentally hit something there. I forgot to mention that they
did install what I call a block heater. The dealer has sent two people both
times they been here. I appreciate the help. Thanks.
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Dave_eng
The low speed exercise feature is intended to spare your neighbors from hearing the roar of your generator exercising every week. Unfortunately, most people find this feature does not work well with rough running the observation. The Quiet mode may also, in cold climates, not warm the unit up enough to dry any condensation out of the oil.

The Quiet mode is selected in the control panel menu system usually called "quiet test mode." Don't be afraid to explore the control panel menu system as you cannot hurt anything. The Esc key brings up various options which you select using the arrow keys and Enter.

The block heater will be a magnetic heater attached to the bottom of the engine. Both the block heater and battery blanket should be connected to a "Thermal Cube," I think this is just a trade name for a temperature sensitive switch which only turns on when outdoor temp is cold. Both the block heater and the battery blanket should be plugged into the thermal switch which will in turn be plugged into an always on receptacle inside the generator housing.

Try turning off the Quiet feature and let us know how it runs.

Dave p
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HKFever
Dave_eng;11658 wrote:
The low speed exercise feature is intended to spare your neighbors from hearing the roar of your generator exercising every week. Unfortunately, most people find this feature does not work well with rough running the observation. The Quiet mode may also, in cold climates, not warm the unit up enough to dry any condensation out of the oil.

The Quiet mode is selected in the control panel menu system usually called "quiet test mode." Don't be afraid to explore the control panel menu system as you cannot hurt anything. The Esc key brings up various options which you select using the arrow keys and Enter.

The block heater will be a magnetic heater attached to the bottom of the engine. Both the block heater and battery blanket should be connected to a [B]"Thermal Cube,"[/B] I think this is just a trade name for a temperature sensitive switch which only turns on when outdoor temp is cold. Both the block heater and the battery blanket should be plugged into the thermal switch which will in turn be plugged into an always on receptacle inside the generator housing.

Try turning off the Quiet feature and let us know how it runs.

Dave p


Here is one that Skip previously linked to. As you can see they offer various temperature ranges.

[url]http://www.amazon.com/Farm-Innovators-TC-2-Thermostatically-Controlled/dp/B000M4ZJ6Y[/url]
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piper18
I just installed the cold weather kit heaters that came with my 17kw and they have a thermostat inline with them. It was 44 degrees today and they weren't heating, I hit the thermostat with some freeze spray and it kicks in. I guess the new ones don't need a separate thermostat.

Bob
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